In the Guardian, Arundhati Roy: Mumbai was not our 9/11, excerpt-
There is a fierce, unforgiving fault-line that runs through the contemporary discourse on terrorism. On one side (let’s call it Side A) are those who see terrorism, especially “Islamist” terrorism, as a hateful, insane scourge that spins on its own axis, in its own orbit and has nothing to do with the world around it, nothing to do with history, geography or economics. Therefore, Side A says, to try and place it in a political context, or even try to understand it, amounts to justifying it and is a crime in itself.
Side B believes that though nothing can ever excuse or justify terrorism, it exists in a particular time, place and political context, and to refuse to see that will only aggravate the problem and put more and more people in harm’s way. Which is a crime in itself.
The sayings of Hafiz Saeed, who founded the Lashkar-e-Taiba (Army of the Pure) in 1990 and who belongs to the hardline Salafi tradition of Islam, certainly bolsters the case of Side A. Hafiz Saeed approves of suicide bombing, hates Jews, Shias and Democracy and believes that jihad should be waged until Islam, his Islam, rules the world. Among the things he said are: “There cannot be any peace while India remains intact. Cut them, cut them so much that they kneel before you and ask for mercy.”
And: “India has shown us this path. We would like to give India a tit-for-tat response and reciprocate in the same way by killing the Hindus, just like it is killing the Muslims in Kashmir.”
But where would Side A accommodate the sayings of Babu Bajrangi of Ahmedabad, India, who sees himself as a democrat, not a terrorist? He was one of the major lynchpins of the 2002 Gujarat genocide and has said (on camera): “We didn’t spare a single Muslim shop, we set everything on fire … we hacked, burned, set on fire … we believe in setting them on fire because these bastards don’t want to be cremated, they’re afraid of it … I have just one last wish … let me be sentenced to death … I don’t care if I’m hanged … just give me two days before my hanging and I will go and have a field day in Juhapura where seven or eight lakhs [seven or eight hundred thousand] of these people stay … I will finish them off … let a few more of them die … at least 25,000 to 50,000 should die.”
13 December, 2008 at 4:40 pm
Arundhati Roy,
Have you read history ? When will you recognise that what the Babu Bajrangis in India do, is in reaction to the atrocities on the Hindus by the muslims, which started many centuries ago. India will not survive the onslaught, if spineless hindus are to guard for the safety of the nation. By the way, are you a hindu ?
Do you have any clue, why the Hindu population has been drastically diminished in last five decades in Bangladesh and Pakistan, while the muslims thrive in India ?
Do you have any count of how many hindus were forced to convert, or killed, how many hindu women raped for being hindu in those countries ?
Did you ever have any problem with the systematic funding, radicalization and training of Jihadis to kill in the name of Islam ? Or you think politicians need to deal with that problem, and it is none of your concerns ?
Winning Booker does not make you larger than life, you have still a lot to learn and develop a spine, specially from people like Salman Rushdie !
14 December, 2008 at 1:24 pm
The debate is not between side (A) and side (B) as Ms. Arundhati Roy would like us to believe. No amount of apologism can justify the brutal acts of murder. Saying it was just poverty or illiteracy that drove these maniacal young people to murder is a clear disgrace. Recently, an Indian minister (Karunanidhi) wrote a lengthy article in the Hindu newspaper about how Muslimsm are being marginalized and being “forced” to take weapons. He invoked the plight of a Muslim boy who is refused a holiday for the Bakrid festival. So what else can he do ? except take up arms and join the Jihad ?
How stupid can we get ?
Saying that poverty and illiteracy is where terrorism is “grounded” in, amounts to mocking the spirit of millions of poor people who live their lives in a dignity amidst misery. It amounts to disrespecting their humanity. And for what sake ? Accomodating some murderous people.
Terrorism is a different problem from poverty. Poverty only exacerbates an already existing disease. The root cause of the disease is hatred. Let’s not hide this hatred amidst our shouts to recognize poverty, illiteracy etc.
This hatred is a simple black-and-white thinking which says (1) we are a group that is entirely pure, virtuous and shining (2) our group is under attack by filthy outsiders. This simplistic thinking is outrageously common amongst Muslims. This is what breeds terrorism. This is the itch which results in the scratching (brutal acts of murder). It is time this itching is eliminated to the root.
And it is not just Muslims who are guilty of this black-and-white thinking. It is obvious that such types exist everywhere in the world : As Ms Roy says, several people who subscribe to the Hindutva ideology are similar in thinking.
But exchanging blame, and highlighting unrelated issues like poverty only amount to apologizing for the brutal acts of murder and hiding the real cause of shame. So let’s stop doing that. We know the root cause; we have to eliminate it as early as possible.
14 December, 2008 at 7:45 pm
I would recommend you both read the full piece it is very considered and does make a compelling case for the context and historical factors on all sides need to be acknowledged. Particularity with a minority Muslim population and the issue of Kashmir still unresolved. Once you look at the whole history it is often the case that whatever the horror of terrorism state acts dwarf them by comparison and they all need to be considered in the understanding of what led to the massacres. Otherwise India will become a police state and terrorism will continue.
14 December, 2008 at 8:03 pm
vakibs: How long are poor people to be expected to “live their lives in a dignity amidst misery” before they fight back?
16 December, 2008 at 6:57 am
Hello Neel123
Why Hindus could not bravely fight with muslim invaders in warfields despite being in “10:1″ ratio?
Killing poor defenselss muslims is womanish, cowrdly, conventional hindu code of bravery.
Pussy Cats!
16 December, 2008 at 7:07 am
Side A, that calls terrorism an ” insane scourge that spins on its own axis, in its own orbit and has nothing to do with the world around it, nothing to do with history, geography or economics” . . . .
Because real men don’t operate outside of time and space and history, this view elevates terrorists to a god-like level of devils. It immortalizes them, which isn’t exactly very clever. Generally it serves to enhance terrorists’ own idealized view of themselves.
Much better to treat them like criminals.
17 December, 2008 at 9:59 am
Arundhati Roy usually has a point – and in order to prove it no extreme extension of the argument is extreme enough. She compares Hafiz Sayeed with some Babu Bajhranghi – who she fails to highlight is not a leader of any Hindu terrorist outfit. If she were to compare the equivalents of Babu Bajranghis in the Muslim world, the numbers and passions would make the scales topple over. To say they want total annihilation of Hindus is an understatement. Enough human rights activists have declared that Islam is fundamentally anti human, anti women and anti rights.
People like her are always saying, “If they do wrong, can we justify ourselves also?” She never says, “We have tried, we have come so far, and this is the way forward”. All she does is complain, complain, complain. Yes, we too have come out from a society badly bruised not only by Mughals, but those not so saintly brits. Who imposed useless laws totally incomprehensible to our rural and less educated folk who do not know what is legal and illegal anymore. How do we get out of the mess?
If she were a true liberator, she would be fighting not the inconsistencies of a struggling democracy like India, but the absolute brutality of communist and islamist states. What surprises is the amount of space and time she devotes to the latter as compared to the former.
17 December, 2008 at 5:04 pm
So as long as somewhere is worse than India she should shut up about India? The Hindu nationalism possesses many fascist qualities and India more than ever needs to address that, which she is doing rather than turning a blinded eye.
18 December, 2008 at 9:22 am
Rana Mehmood Saab,
you talk about the bravery and you mention about ratio. The bravery is evident from the Barbaric History. The kings were attacked when they were unconscious.(AKBAR THE GREAT killed hemu). If you want to have the current examples take what happened in Pakisthan and Bangaladesh. Why hindu popluation dwindled to almost to nill while Muslim population thrived in India.
What was the ratio in Kashmir while our Muslim brethren kicked out Hindu minority(<5%) .Were they armed. Regarding the ratio Almost all muslim is like a warrior as they respond to war call(Read Jehad) while among hindus not all are warriors.THe Hindu soceity is structured in such a way that not all are warriors the advantage of which is taken by others who make their presence felt multiple time of what they are.
18 December, 2008 at 11:39 am
Not Sure what is expected of Hindus who have lost a vast stretch of land from Arabia to pakisthan.Christians and Muslims have their land through out the world. Where will the Hindus go .THe situation is already clear that we are heading towards a pre partition situation and likely to have more khilafat movement, Moplah rights to come.Can anyone gaurentee that Hindus will have their freedom after 25-30 years.
18 December, 2008 at 4:08 pm
@RickB: You seem to be making us laugh by raising the likes of Arundhati Roy to those of some Saint! Just answer my simple question for yourself, and you prob will have the answer to what needs more attention. Were one to be having a mild headache when he already has been found HIV+, I wonder what would that person be more worried about? You seem to be suggesting the headache. Not that the headache is acceptable or should not be treated, but you must be out of your mind to suggest that you would devote your reources and time to treating headache rather than the bigger menace. Lets get this straight- The Islamists (and not all of them) have been kiling brutally people all across the world- Right from Asia, to Africa, Middle East, Spain, London, the U.S.. Are you suggesting that you have the Babu Bajrangis all across the world, and more importantly, they are all targeting the Muslims. Go see a psych..and suggest this to Arundhati to acompany you. You guys are the last bunch of buffons left on this dangerous world and we can’t afford to loose you
Nothing personal, dude..
18 December, 2008 at 5:00 pm
Well the psych is all booked up with cases of Islamophobia…
19 December, 2008 at 7:11 am
i have one word for people like Ms.Roy or is it two..”PSEUDO-SECULAR”
20 December, 2008 at 7:13 am
Awesome article by Ms.Arundhati Roy.
Just wondering how long they are gonna call Kashmir to be “Integral part of India”.They are just playing with danger,let them do it.
Justice or Civil War,bros decide ? hahaha
20 December, 2008 at 3:43 pm
Roy !!! u r a great Indian who has greatly impressed me. Very few people speak truth in india and pak and u r one of them. Boys ! Dont abuse. She is a lady of respect. We all need such people and such a true media. Love you ROY
21 December, 2008 at 8:28 am
Arundhati Roy is stupid, cheap and acutely myopic. She’d shave her head and sleep with the devil if that was a “non-populist” thing to do.
Anyone Indian or Paki to believe her is insane.
And for the millionth time it’s not about Hindus Vs Muslims…. the common man has too much to worry about instead of this ‘clash of civilizations’.
Ms Roy is just like the rabid politicians on both the sides, divisive, exploitative and selfish.
21 December, 2008 at 6:42 pm
Arundhati Roy tries to win a booker for every piece of article she writes … it lloks like that.
As a reluctant hindu, she feels guilty of many things in a Hindu-majority India. She can’t see things in plain black & white.
For every major terror attack, do you have to make a reference to Babri, Gujarat & Kashmir ? Except for Babri, other events are all reactions. For Gujarat there was a Godhra which Roy conveniently forgets !
How can you cite illiteracy & unemployment as reasons for Muslims taking upto Terrorism ? If thats true, then why educated software professionals are indulging in such acts ?
She turns a blind eye to the slient majority of Hindus who are poor & peace-loving & struggle to make a 2-time meals. Still these people try to teach basics to their children & impart our culture to them & try to raise them in the best way possible.
Compare this to the Muslim families … how many Muslim girls are seen in reality-shows like singing contests atleast ? Why Muslims girls are kept indoors while boys thrive in all professions including terrorism ! Why Ms. Roy can’t write about the plight of Muslim women persecuted (remember shah bano case) ?
And the nauseating talk of injustice by Ms. Roy … in a country where we had 2 Muslim presidents, 2 Muslim VPs, a Muslim Speaker & more than half a dozen CMs of various states !
Compare this to Pakistan where a first Hindu was elevated to the post Chief Justice but was brought down within weeks just becoz he was a Hindu ! And Ms Roy doesn’t have any words for this event ?
Being a born Hindu has forced to her to take up the guilt position & she has a gift from God (Hindu God or Muslim God ??) … she has a way with words.
Ms. Roy tries to solve all problems at once & tries to inter-link all events & weave them into a big puzzle. Actually she needs to relax, have sex & unwind in the sun before throwing such articles for public consumtion.
22 December, 2008 at 10:39 am
I THINK THE BEST POSSIBLE SOLUTION FOR THE SATISFACTION OF Ms. ARUNDHATI IS TO GET MARRIED WITH ‘KASAB’(one of The boy-terrorists’ who mesmerised their international audience by aatacking mumbai.). I THINK KASAB IS BACHELOR TOO. SO THERE WILL BE NO PROBLEM FOR Ms.ARUNDHATI. THOUGH THERE IS ONE MORE OPTION or u can say great opportunity is AVAILABLE FOR Ms. ARUNDHATI. THE OPTION IS ‘AFZAL GURU’ THE MASTERMIND OF PARLIAMENT ATTACK. 4 NIKAH ARE ALREADY PERMISSIBLE IN ISLAM, SO FOR Ms. ARUNDHATI THERE IS NO PROBLEM IN THIS OPTION ALSO. BY DOING THIS SHE WILL DO THE GREAT SERVICE OF MORALE BOOSTING OF THE SOCIETY OF GREAT SOLDIERS, WHO ARE GIVING BEFITTING REPLY TO HINDU FUNDAMENTALISTS (according to ms. arundhati ) LIKE KASAB & AFZAL GURU. WHO KNOWS THAT THIS WILL BRING A NOBLE PRIZE FOR HER INSTEAD OF ANOTHER BOOKER. BELIEVE ME ITS A MATTER OF ASSURANCE ONLY. JUST ASSURE HER OF THAT NOBLE…. SHE WILL HURRIEDLY FOLLOW THE ADVICE, GETTING MARRIED TO KASAB OR AFZAL GURU.
22 December, 2008 at 9:20 pm
The animosity towards her reasonable article rather proves her accusations, but keep it up fellas, enough rope an’ all.
23 December, 2008 at 12:55 pm
Ha ha ha. That is the dumbest line ever -> “The animosity towards her reasonable article proves her accusations”.
You are a typical fundamentalist who will never heed to reasons and generalize like an immature brain that is so self-righteous that it refuses to listen to anybody else.
Ditto, Arundhati Roy.
23 December, 2008 at 5:47 pm
She is the other Antulay of India who needs to be kicked out. Seriously, I am convinced that she is brain dead.
23 December, 2008 at 8:00 pm
Stop proving me right you guys!
24 December, 2008 at 7:57 am
roy is cool. don’t forget what sartre said “terrorism is the atom bomb of the poor”
27 December, 2008 at 3:51 pm
A disgusting article from Arundhati roy.. I dont believe mumbai attacks were totally from fundamentalists based in pakistan.. It was a pak state sponsored event under the guise of jihad.. Which is really very sad.. The events have nothing to do with poor etc.. These class issues are there in every developing nation.. That doesn’t mean we see events like these everywhere.. As far as gujarat is concerned.. yes.. the culprits should be brought to book. but again there are people like zaheera sheikh who made a mockery of the justice system.
28 December, 2008 at 1:26 am
I really cannot figure out how
a) poverty and illiteracy in India,
b) Gujarat,
c) Bangladesh,
d) Kashmir etc etc
is linked to
murderous activities of a bunch of Pakistanis fanatics, who are
a) not connected to INDIAN poverty,
b) not connected Gujarat,
c) not connected to INDIAN illiteracy,
d) not connected to Kashmir
The only reason that anyone would want to link and interweave all this are people who are hyphenated in their vision, are apologetic about themselves, are “like minded” to these elements or who want to conveniently forget the real issue because they have perpetrated it themselves
3 January, 2009 at 10:46 am
In an article published in India Abroad which covered an Asia Society event co-hosted by the South Asian Journalists Association which featured Salman Rushdie, this is what he had to say about the insensitive and illogical article written by Arundathi Roy in the Guardian.
He said that that the Pakistan Elite was jealous of India’s progress as a democracy and as an economic power. He blasted the ‘nauseating ‘ reaction of Arundathi Roy and the ‘utter duplicity’ of the Pakistan government. Rushdie said that India’s pluralistic democracy and economic growth were the real targets. ‘Broadly speaking, India is a free country; broadly speaking, India is a democracy and broadly speaking, India is economically successful’ he said.
‘On the other hand Pakistan is a basket case. There is no institution in Pakistan on which a free society can be built’
He was particularly harsh on the liberal left and in particular Arundathi Roy, who had argued that the violence was a reaction to how Muslims were being treated in India, and warned that if the plight of the Muslims were not improved, India would face a civil war. ‘I want to take issue with this,’ he said. ‘It is disgusting to read her comments’. He pointed out that Roy had said much of the outrage owed to the fact that the Taj Mahal Hotel and Oberoi Hotel, targets of the terrorists, were the haunts of the rich, and that it was because the rich had been killed that there was so much outrage.
How about the over one dozen employees of the Taj who died heroically while trying to save the hotel guests, Rushdie asked. ‘Are the then just the lackeys of the rich? I find her thoughts nauseating. She should be ashamed of herself.
Thankfully we have an intellectual like Salman Rushdie to put things in perspective. Self hating Hindus such as Roy should not be left unchallenged. It is ironic that Salman who was born a Muslim should be the one to challenge this despicable woman.
3 January, 2009 at 1:19 pm
People in the hinterland often say :
“Its better to have 5 minutes of fame, than live an entire life without name”. Arundotty has had her 5 minutes of fame when she won a Booker by confounding a bunch of white people who will find it absolutely impossible, by any stretch of imagination, to be able to relate to an Indian cast-infested setting [as she herself puts it, and proudly claims no one gets it!]
such as the one in the “God of Small Things”.
Her one shot at success now over, she now wants to turn eyeballs. And what is better than becoming a global conspiracy-theorist. She bandies up with leftists and “social-activists” around the country and the world to buttress her inflammatory and psychotic “conspiracy theory” agenda, leveraging her “5 minutes” of fame. Who is Arundotty but the writer of that one book? Honestly, unless you google for it, she hasn’t done anything else at all – PERIOD. While it doesn’t mean she isn’t entitled to an opinion, or isn’t entitled to fight to “causes” the very causes she espouses, and the manner in which she does them is nothing more but to inflame, and titilate its ever eager audience of people who claim to “want to hear the truth”.
Now why would she be hanging around the USofA, giving speeches on C-Span, talking trash about the “Imperialist Americans” and “Kashmir-oppressing Hindus” if she didn’t want to be in the limelight. More fuel to the flame, means more invites to more conferences, more opportunities to write in left-wing radical papers, and especially the UK which absolutely loves trashing India [less in America who are more nationalists]. Arundotty’s position would be well served in leveraging her cheap “5 minutes” of fame in serving the country, by attempting to provide solutions to problems. It doesn’t lie in rubbing salt on its wounds. Just like no family goes out on to the streets and dissects its problems, Arundotty would be well served to be a part of the very system she spits her bile at, to counter India’s social problems. There is a lot of good that her talent can do, especially now since she has this audience, but then people in India wouldn’t want to hear about problems of Hindus anyway, n’est ce pas?
She claims in one of her interviews I read post 9/11 [America shouldn't enter a war of vengeance] that she could be anyplace in the world at that moment but chooses to be in India – well you aren’t exactly doing us a favor – you can be like the many cheap-shot NRI’s sitting abroad in stiff parties, wearing a blazer, sipping their sherry, and making conversation with their white master all the while belching “India is a 4th world country, I am glad to be out of there!” which is more of a cry for “adopt me beneveolent white people!”
6 January, 2009 at 3:45 pm
I believe it is time to wake up and smell the coffee. Liberal thinking only works when the objects of said thougts are like-minded liberal thinkers. The lofty ideals of Ms.Arundhati Roy do not hold water in the face of rabid, machine gun toting religionists intent on killing their way into paradise.
Also if incidents such as the mumbai carnage are reactions of a marginalised and victimised populace, then it seems to me that the whole world is united in victimising them. India is not alone in being the target of these fundamentalists. You see it in every corner of the world. In places like UK which grants asylum to those escaping islamic terrorism in their own islamic nations, these scum dont go back in biting the very hand that feeds them.
So the problem is not with the rest of the world victimising them, the problem is with Islam and its radical socio-political message. Unless we wake up to this fact and stop being politcally correct to the extent of being killed for it, this will continue. They have no reason to be politically correct and they have every reason to kill.
7 January, 2009 at 12:49 pm
I cannot but help noticing that arundhati chooses her words very carefully. when she describes the terrorists there is an element of admiration in the words associated with them, though she does the motions of apparently denouncing them. when she describes the persons protesting against the ghastly deed she is sometimes mocking, sometimes contemptuous, sometimes being holier than thou ‘preacher’. I think the gist of the article is that India is a garbage bin and therefore deserves all the garbage thrown in it. certain people have made a livelihood out of abusing everything they are associated with – their country, language, culture, institutions. she finds nothing good in this country, she abuses our institutions – judiciary, parliament, executive, media, the common people. please dont torment yourself by living in this country if you are unhappy with it
8 January, 2009 at 8:53 am
Now that the texts of the conversation of handlers is also out “u have killed a commissioner” her usual conspiracy theories about anything to do with terrorism is also exposed. Talking of conspiracy theories – I was wondering what would I do if I were an extremely articulate person with some intellecual standing in india and the ISI had approached and suborned me with an agenda to attack India on every forum on every occassion. Would my reactions be any different than Ms.Roy I just wonder.
8 January, 2009 at 11:59 pm
The posts by the Hindu fundamentalists here only shows that all religious extremism is loopy. It’s not a matter of one specific faith.
10 January, 2009 at 9:08 pm
It’s pretty instructive the Hindu Indian nationalism is strong indeed.
11 January, 2009 at 12:35 pm
How quick the liberals are to judge those who differ from them in opinion. How come it is that Islamists are never fundamentalists, but the ones who speak against their practices are? Why is it that the liberals pander to Islamist sensibilities, but opposing opinions are considered loopy? Islamic fundamentalists have the right to kill indiscriminately and be seen as a victimised people venting their frustrations and the ones who dont subscribe to this view seen as Hindu Indian nationalists. It is this thinking that is loopy. It is high time that people like Arundathi Roy and her likes get their head out of the sand and face the truth. It is much closer to home than you imagine, and YOU just might be the next victim. Remember, Jihad is no respecter of persons…..unless of course you are a muslim.
11 January, 2009 at 9:29 pm
I guess those that don’t read, can never understand.
14 July, 2009 at 1:35 pm
I felt so very “enlightened” and “educated” after reading so much about my religion from some of the “experts” over here, explaining what Islam is all about, really is that what you think Islam and Muslims, or these all littlie “pleasantries” are for Pakistani Muslims, I think second option is more likely, how long you people want to live in the Pakistani phobia, and ignore alarming signs, just accept the existence of my country from your heart and leave communal hatred towards Muslims living in India, not only Muslims but also other minorities.
You all have to accept the fact that your problems are not Pakistan oriented, Come on people if you demolish a mosque or try to hide a massacre, your actually suppressing a whole 170 million community, and then in reaction if some one retaliates you start looking over to us, problem to your solutions lies in your lands not ours, this is what people like Arundhatti Roy and others are trying to point out, listen to them and try to fix what is wrong instead of criticizing without suggesting alternate.
People of Pakistan want friendly relations with all our neighbors including India, but on the parity basis, if some one think he is superior or he can dominate, he is so very wrong, more then 60 years of our existence have proved our valiant nature and amount of toughness we posses.
14 July, 2009 at 6:47 pm
Hear, hear Ahson.